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Did you know nomination

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The following is an archived discussion of the DYK nomination of the article below. Please do not modify this page. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as this nomination's talk page, the article's talk page or Wikipedia talk:Did you know), unless there is consensus to re-open the discussion at this page. Track your hook after promotion. No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was: promoted by TechnoSquirrel69 (talk) 00:58, 21 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]

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Moved to mainspace by Oreun (talk). Number of QPQs required: 0. Nominator has fewer than 5 past nominations.

Oreun 💬Talk 16:46, 20 April 2026 (UTC).[reply]

I take, will review in the next 24 hours.--Launchballer 15:22, 1 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]
@Oreun and Zxcvbnm: Long enough, new enough, Earwig is clean. No QPQ necessary. ALT1 violates WP:DYKFICTION, ALT2 is only interesting to fans of those biblical characters, ALT3 is dull, and ALT0 wants ending at 'trope' per WP:DYKTRIM; ALT4 checks out but suggest yeeting 'over her facial expressions' and replacing 'BioWare' with 'its developer'. What makes ref 35 reliable given WP:RGATE?--Launchballer 14:09, 2 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]
@Launchballer: Here are the new modified alts:
ALT4a: ... that a gameplay trailer featuring Mass Effect: Andromeda's Sara Ryder drew such criticism that its developer issued a public apology before the game even launched? Source: Chalk, Andy (January 3, 2017) "BioWare boss says Ryder is "awesome," promises animations will be improved" PC Gamer https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-boss-says-ryder-is-awesome-promises-animations-will-be-improved/
ALT0a: ... that Mass Effect: Andromeda's Pathfinder Ryder has been criticized for reinforcing a damsel-in-distress trope?
Source: Schallegger, René Reinhold (2018). "Only Human After All? The Surprising (and Avoidable) Failure of Mass Effect: Andromeda" https://www.kanada-studien.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/03/zks_2020_complete-issue-70.pdf
Ref 35 was published by Ovidius University Press, the official publishing house of the Ovidius University of Constanta, Romania. I have now replaced the link to ResearchGate with the publisher's version. Oreun 💬Talk 14:58, 2 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]
I did a double take when I read "biblical characters". I feel like that was meant to say "literary characters". I still disagree that it would only be interesting to "fans" of those characters (do those exist?) but 4 was my favorite anyway.
"Its developer, BioWare" would be a good compromise in my opinion. BioWare is one of the world's best-known game developers, though, and it would not be weird to outright mention them. I also think "character animations" would be a good "average Joe level of video game knowledge" substitute for "facial animations" without making it so vague it wasn't clear why she was being criticized. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 03:15, 3 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]
Alt 4 is also my personal preference, updating it with Zx's suggestions:
ALT4b: ... that a gameplay trailer featuring Mass Effect: Andromeda's Sara Ryder drew such criticism over her character animations that its developer, BioWare, issued a public apology before the game even launched? Source: Chalk, Andy (January 3, 2017) "BioWare boss says Ryder is "awesome," promises animations will be improved" PC Gamer https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-boss-says-ryder-is-awesome-promises-animations-will-be-improved/
If the name of the name of the developer cannot be included, perhaps a compromise would be to link "its developer" to the BioWare article:
ALT4c: ... that a gameplay trailer featuring Mass Effect: Andromeda's Sara Ryder drew such criticism over her character animations that its developer issued a public apology before the game even launched? Source: Chalk, Andy (January 3, 2017) "BioWare boss says Ryder is "awesome," promises animations will be improved" PC Gamer https://www.pcgamer.com/bioware-boss-says-ryder-is-awesome-promises-animations-will-be-improved/ Oreun 💬Talk 08:15, 3 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]
verified for ALT4b and ALT4. Cunard (talk) 09:21, 15 June 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Article name

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@Oreun: Is there any opposition to this being moved to Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda)? I have never seen him/her referred to as "Pathfinder Ryder", only "Pathfinder" and "Ryder" separately. Therefore, in my opinion, it doesn't count as WP:NATURAL. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 07:12, 21 April 2026 (UTC)[reply]

While I'm still relatively new to Wikipedia, I'm not sure I quite agree with your reasoning. Looking at other articles, they typically introduce the character as "Pathfinder Ryder" first, then use "Ryder" thereafter if at all. Check Mass Effect, List of Mass Effect characters, Suspended animation in fiction, List of video games with LGBTQ characters and Liara T'Soni (The only exception would be Mass Effect: Andromeda, which first names them as Sara and Scott, both of which I've redirected to this page).
I'd argue to keep this as Pathfinder Ryder is the best decision for consistency, as Commander Shepard follows similar trends and is kept as Commander Shepard and not just Shepard (Mass Effect). Additionally, if your proposed move were to be implemented regardless, wouldn't it be better to change it to Ryder (Mass Effect) instead of Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda) Oreun 💬Talk 15:06, 21 April 2026 (UTC)[reply]
You are citing other Wikipedia articles, which is still not offering evidence that *reliable sources* commonly call him/her "Pathfinder Ryder". On the other hand, I can find many that just call them Ryder, like this, this, this, et cetera. I will say that I chose the full game name because Ryder does not appear in multiple Mass Effect games. It is only inconsistent because Shepard appears in several, so there would be no reason to append any specific game to his/her disambiguation. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 16:15, 21 April 2026 (UTC)[reply]
I used other wikipedia articles as an example of how "people would naturally use to link to the article from other articles". Still, just one quick google search gave me a few articles from reliable sources that mention the character as "Pathfinder Ryder", like this, this and this, and there's probably more. I don't think you actually adressed my point when it comes to the inconsistencies that would be created with Commander Shepard. Shepard is also usually referred to by surname alone in many sources, yet their article is titled Commander Shepard rather than Shepard (Mass Effect). To follow WP:CONSISTENT I think both articles should follow the same rationale, and if the rationale for the current title is that "Pathfinder Ryder" isn't WP:NATURAL, the same rationale should apply to Shepard's article. Oreun 💬Talk 17:12, 21 April 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Requested move 21 April 2026

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The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: No consensus. EdJohnston (talk) 17:27, 26 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Pathfinder Ryder → Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda) – See discussion above, which the article creator disputed, causing me to seek to open an RM. I believe that "Pathfinder Ryder" is not a very common name for Ryder, only used rather sparingly in the gaming media and by fans. Ryder is much more typically called Ryder, enough that WP:NATURAL does not apply. The fact that Mass Effect: Andromeda is specified in the disambiguation is because he/she only appears in that one game. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 18:39, 21 April 2026 (UTC) — Relisting. 1isall (talk | contribs) 19:01, 28 April 2026 (UTC) — Relisting. ⹃Maltazarian ᚾparleyinvestigateᛅ 04:57, 6 May 2026 (UTC) — Relisting. TarnishedPathtalk 23:14, 13 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Oppose. Per WP:AT, the question is whether the proposed title is better on recognizability, naturalness, precision, concision, and consistency taken together, not whether some sources use a shorter form in passing. This article covers the combined Scott/Sara Ryder player-character topic, two interchangeable but distinct characters and not a single fixed individual, and reliable sources also frame the subject through the inherited Pathfinder role. While some sources do often shorten the character to “Ryder” in running prose, analogous to how many sources treat Commander Shepard, that does not show that Ryder is the clearest umbrella title for the combined Scott/Sara player-character topic. Multiple reliable sources explicitly use “Pathfinder Ryder” or identify the protagonist primarily through the Pathfinder role. Polygon’s review refers to “Pathfinder Ryder — a brother or sister, depending on the gender you choose,” and Game Informer refers to the campaign as “the adventures of Pathfinder Ryder.”
Just as importantly, the sources also separately discuss Alec Ryder as a distinct character and the original Pathfinder, which weakens the claim that Ryder alone is the most precise or natural identifying label for the page’s subject. PC Gamer coverage explicitly distinguishes Alec Ryder from the player character who inherits the Pathfinder role. In that context, Pathfinder Ryder is a reasonable, precise umbrella title for a page covering both Scott and Sara together per WP:PRECISION and WP:CONSISTENCY, and it is more specific than the proposed Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda). The move rationale does not show that Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda) is clearly superior under WP:COMMONNAME or WP:NATURAL. The current title is the better choice for article name. Haleth (talk) 11:54, 1 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]
If there is seriously confusion between Alec Ryder and the player character, then perhaps Scott and Sara Ryder would be a better option. It would remove the need for disambiguation while still being a more commonly used name. ᴢxᴄᴠʙɴᴍ (ᴛ) 21:54, 3 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]
(Article creator comment) I didn't choose to go for that title because the article covers the player character as a whole and, while it did receive some commentary using the default names, these tend to refer to a specific gender variant rather than the character as a whole (similarly to how "FemShep" or "Female Shepard" are used to refer specifically to the female Commander Shepard). For example, in criticism of female Ryder's animations she's typically referred to as "Sara" rather than "Ryder", "Pathfinder Ryder" or "Pathfinder", while this Eurogamer article uses the default names to differentiate the default backgrounds assigned to the player character depending on the gender and this recent article uses Scott's name to address the complaints made by his voice actor with the game's development. However, as Haleth stated, most reviews tend to use either "Pathfinder Ryder", or simply "Ryder" in running prose. While no specific name-change statistics have been released by BioWare, the name "Scott and Sara Ryder" could cause confusion with players that didn't use the default name for the player character. And for those who did, or readers who encounter those names elsewhere, Scott Ryder and Sara Ryder are already set up as redirects. Oreun 💬Talk 18:34, 5 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]
Note: WikiProject Fictional characters, WikiProject Science Fiction, WikiProject Video games, and WikiProject Video games/Video game characters have been notified of this discussion. ⹃Maltazarian ᚾparleyinvestigateᛅ 04:58, 6 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]

Weak Oppose Scott and Sara Ryder – mainly as it seems to refer to two people (which I suppose is the case in-universe, but the sources seem to mostly discuss "Ryder" as the player's choice of character). I actually see more use of "Scott or Sara Ryder" (and the inverse), after looking at all the sources, several use the conventions interchangeably, preferring "Ryder" for brevity (four academic sources for a video game, ftw). I know that's not going to get us anywhere, but I am undecided between disambig. options Pathfinder Ryder and Ryder (Mass Effect: Andromeda). I prefer the context of the parenthetical while I also find "Pathfinder Ryder" to be a better WP:NATDIS. If anything, the current title is slightly more concise. ASUKITE 23:34, 13 May 2026 (UTC)[reply]

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.
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